It would be nice if there was a way to rip out any questionable software/electric components from modern cars and replace it with something open source.
Of course, public transport has a limit and we can root for both as well, including protected bike lanes even in the boonies like we successfully see in the Netherlands
I’m somewhat hopeful, in the last ten years, new and renovated country roads have been getting dedicated bike lanes behind the guardrails. Miles away from the excellent, completely separate infrastructure the dutch have, but its a start.
i am afraid it is just that most CEOs are sane enough to keep their embarrassing moments for their private life. do you think musk is the only narcissistic psychopath on drugs in the business world?
this is not advocating for musk, but it is important to be grounded in reality ;)
To be fair, I think most of USA is on recreational drugs, legal, illegal, or “prescription”. That shouldn’t matter as much compared to his other actions.
I don’t know that they’re out to make money though. A lot of the Chinese manufacturers are now struggling due to the price war they instigated themselves. Huge production surplus but they pushed down the price so much they hardly make any money
Competition is fierce, but they are not exactly struggling due to government subsidies/incentives. These are so extreme that Chinese manufacturers are over producing and dumping “used” EVs with zero mileage for export.
Similar to US agricultural dumping, this is a terrible policy for everyone, except for the beneficiaries of the subsidies, and maybe the overseas consumers who get cheap EVs in the short term.
If you don’t see musk as one of the singular greatest threats to this planet, I dunno what to tell you. It is certainly not just the salute, that was just the most public he’s been about his true self. If I recall those Nazis had some thoughts on the Holocaust as well.
How many of those got up on stage with the seal of the president of the United States and did one of the most identifiable actions of the last true fascist regime? musk was able to spend $250 million to pretend to be president for a few months to kneecap the US government and kill all the investigations into his illegal dealings as well as reward his companies with lucrative government contracts. I’d love to see any of those tinpot dictators and “communist” leaders do that.
Putin is the head of the paper tiger Russia. If they didn’t have nukes the US probably would have steam rolled them back in 2014 when they took Crimea. If the world actually gave Ukraine the weapons and resources to do it, I have no doubt they could be at Moscow’s door in a couple months.
Kim Jung Un is the head of a pariah state who relies on worldwide aide so that his people don’t starve more than they already are starving.
Sure Xi is the head of the state in which there is obviously genocide happening, but he’s not running a car company, which is what this whole article is about.
Riiight. Listen, this isn’t going anywhere. You think a salute is worse than a genocide, musk is a greater threat than dictators with nukes, and there’s no way I’m going to change your mind. I’m going to peace out
In a couple months a drug fueled musk did to the US what Xi and Putin have been trying to do for decades. It most certainly wasn’t just his salute that made me think that.
You could change my mind if you brought any information to the table that shows how those two are worse than musk.
Xi became president for life almost a decade ago, Putin ignored term limits in like 2008. Musk is failing to do what they have done, and he doesn’t even express any real power over the president given he hid his role from the courts and left the white house with a black eye.
Competition is good for the consumer. More options from more players will encourage more charging infrastructure and (ostensibly) more innovation. It’s not just Elon Musk vs China. Every automaker that wants to sell cars in the USA is on notice. If they want to compete in the EV subcategory, they need to focus on price and performance. People want budget-conscious EVs.
Not super into cars but is there even any reason other than environmental friendliness to get an EV? Where I’m from, EVs are all wildly expensive compared to their combustion peers and they all frankly look really ugly to me. The coil whine of the EVs also drive me crazy.
Even the cheap ones accelerate faster, ride smoother, and are quieter. You don’t have to get oil changes, and the brakes don’t wear down as fast. Plus I can recharge at home, which is loads cheaper than buying gasoline.
And this is all with a relatively ancient Nissan Leaf, the new vehicles are all far better.
Oh, and let’s not forget that even very small air quality improvements have noticeable improvements in lung health! Humans were not meant to be breathing gasoline fumes or combustion exhaust.
My government just added a controversial extra tax on EVs because they tear up the roads and cause additional particles, because they are really heavy and most of them have a better than usual torque.
You can really see how road quality went to shit after EVs became mainstream.
Making batteries is also a really ugly business and far from environmental.
Others have addressed your other questions, but I want to add that the “coil whine” that irritates you is probably the car’s slow-moving warning system. EVs are effectively silent at slow speeds because there is no engine noise or road noise, so they are required to make an annoying sound when maneuvering to get your attention. While it is an important safety feature, I agree some are very obnoxious.
I’m not sure if we’re talking about the same sound as it’s so high pitched that most people older than me are unable to even hear it while people my age or younger can clearly identify it. If that’s supposed to be a warning system, it doesn’t seem very good?
I mean, it’s also entirely possible you’ve heard a failing magnetic drive, a humming battery, or a squeeky mechanical thing like brakes or bearings. Those are all strong indicators of a significant problem with the car, and should be fixed immediately. But if you hear it every time, as soon as the car starts moving in a parking lot, that’s the safety feature.
They make decent “point A to point B” cars, but that’s about it. They take a long time to charge, and when that battery is due for replacement, it might just total the car.
They manufacture everything, they are just people chilling in their country. Say what you will about their form of government but BYD havent invested in hurting people for no reason.
unless you for some reason like leftist dictator who would like to rule the world more than the right one, there isn’t really practical difference in this
China would love so much to rule the world, that’s why it hasn’t entered any war in the past 40+ years, and that’s why all countries in the global south are happy to enter the comparably advantageous economic deals and infrastructure investments that China offers in comparison with the magnificent western democracies.
How many countries has China bombed in the past 40 years? Let’s now make a list for the USA, see who wins!
As for “dictator”, look at the approval rates of Xi in China and compare them to those of Kid Starver in the UK, Trump in the US, or Macron in France. I guess democracy is best represented by the system that lets you choose which hateful ghoul will apply social austerity policy and invest 5% of GDP in NATO.
the global south are happy to enter the comparably advantageous economic deals
are they happy? and are the deals advantageous? can you back up your claims? 😂
As for “dictator”, look at the approval rates of Xi in China
oh yes, the approval rating of a dictator in a dictatorship is very valid metric 😂. (hint hint: they are irrelevant even if they were not fixed. any kind of approval rating bears zero relevance to whether the country is a totalitarian state or not, or whether the country is a threat to its neighbours or not).
I agree until the last part. Democracies have more freedoms allowing for more accurate polling. There is also less fear of consequences for being open. Countries should be able to defend themselves, 5% is a step toward peace. The cold war never became hot because of the investment in defence.
Tell that to the millions of people the west murdered through bombing of Korea, Vietnam or Laos, the millions more murdered though US support of military dictators such as Suharto or Pinochet, or the millions who died through the de-stabilization of their countries such as Mosaddeq’s Iran, Guatemala or the outright invasion of Iraq. Ask those people what they think of the west’s military expenses over the past century.
Democracies have more freedoms allowing for more accurate polling. There is also less fear of consequences for being open
Literally two days ago Mamdani won the mayoral elections against all polls, polls in the west are heavily manipulated. And literally last week a man was denied entry in the country due to having a picture of bald Vance. I happen to be Spanish, and in our super-democratic state we have literal political prisoners who had to free the country such as Carles Puigdemont due to political persecution and risking their lives in jail. The west is NOT more democratic than China at this point, and the trend is towards openness in China and towards fascism in the west.
The trend is toward openness in China? Just off the top of my head didnt Xi consolidate more power over the last 12 months and stop issuing economic statistics as a resukt of their trend?
I am not American, they are a shit hole country, they have never been much more but the veneer is wiped off now.
Those proxy wars are the example of it not getting hot. Russia and the US had so much military power no one risked direct attacks.
I do not support the US, Israel or any such shite but dont tell half a story and sum up with china is opening up.
Telsas total european market share this month is 1.2%, down from 1.8% last may. The chinese market share is 5.9%, not 5.6%.
5.9% vs 1.2% is a 5x sales rate for chinese cars versus Teslas. According to the article, china doubled its EU market share in the last year, while Tesla lost 30% of its market share in the same time period.
The title is not sensational. If anything, your comment is a bit misleading by not listing the tesla EU market share.
i hate musk, but i am not wild about our dependence on china either, so i am not really sure who to root for in this fight…
It would be nice if there was a way to rip out any questionable software/electric components from modern cars and replace it with something open source.
Root for better public transport and active cities instead of car dependency :)
Living in the boonies, I’m never going to get a bus going by every ten minutes so a solid market for good EVs is still what I root for.
Of course, public transport has a limit and we can root for both as well, including protected bike lanes even in the boonies like we successfully see in the Netherlands
I’m somewhat hopeful, in the last ten years, new and renovated country roads have been getting dedicated bike lanes behind the guardrails. Miles away from the excellent, completely separate infrastructure the dutch have, but its a start.
The public transport bus I take to and from work is a Chinese made electric. It’s a Yutong E15.
I remember that one getting tested in my hometown.
How common are these in Denmark? 😮 don’t feel like I’ve seen one, but then again it’s not like I study the make before I get in the bus
This specific model I don’t know, but in Copenhagen all public transport buses will be electric by the end of 2026.
I don’t want to be like China though /s
I would say go with whatever company that doesn’t have a CEO throwing Nazi salutes.
i am afraid it is just that most CEOs are sane enough to keep their embarrassing moments for their private life. do you think musk is the only narcissistic psychopath on drugs in the business world?
this is not advocating for musk, but it is important to be grounded in reality ;)
To be fair, I think most of USA is on recreational drugs, legal, illegal, or “prescription”. That shouldn’t matter as much compared to his other actions.
Yeah, the Chinese manufacturers are out to make money, and at least we know what to expect from them.
Besides, being profitable usually means making a better product than your competitors.
I don’t know that they’re out to make money though. A lot of the Chinese manufacturers are now struggling due to the price war they instigated themselves. Huge production surplus but they pushed down the price so much they hardly make any money
I think a lot of it is also growing their market share and establishing their brand.
Competition is fierce, but they are not exactly struggling due to government subsidies/incentives. These are so extreme that Chinese manufacturers are over producing and dumping “used” EVs with zero mileage for export.
Similar to US agricultural dumping, this is a terrible policy for everyone, except for the beneficiaries of the subsidies, and maybe the overseas consumers who get cheap EVs in the short term.
China’s Zero-Mile ‘Used’ EVs Are Flooding Global Markets - https://insideevs.com/news/763687/china-zero-mile-used-evs/
So support the country committing a genocide against the uyghurs? Because you think a salute is worse than a Holocaust, got it.
With that level of indirection gymnastics, you can accuse anyone of anything.
(This comment written in the language of a brutally colonizing and genocidal empire.)
Canada?
If you don’t see musk as one of the singular greatest threats to this planet, I dunno what to tell you. It is certainly not just the salute, that was just the most public he’s been about his true self. If I recall those Nazis had some thoughts on the Holocaust as well.
I really don’t. Putin, Kim Jong Un, Xi Jinping, all are actual threats. Musk doesn’t even register.
How many of those got up on stage with the seal of the president of the United States and did one of the most identifiable actions of the last true fascist regime? musk was able to spend $250 million to pretend to be president for a few months to kneecap the US government and kill all the investigations into his illegal dealings as well as reward his companies with lucrative government contracts. I’d love to see any of those tinpot dictators and “communist” leaders do that.
Putin is the head of the paper tiger Russia. If they didn’t have nukes the US probably would have steam rolled them back in 2014 when they took Crimea. If the world actually gave Ukraine the weapons and resources to do it, I have no doubt they could be at Moscow’s door in a couple months.
Kim Jung Un is the head of a pariah state who relies on worldwide aide so that his people don’t starve more than they already are starving.
Sure Xi is the head of the state in which there is obviously genocide happening, but he’s not running a car company, which is what this whole article is about.
Riiight. Listen, this isn’t going anywhere. You think a salute is worse than a genocide, musk is a greater threat than dictators with nukes, and there’s no way I’m going to change your mind. I’m going to peace out
In a couple months a drug fueled musk did to the US what Xi and Putin have been trying to do for decades. It most certainly wasn’t just his salute that made me think that.
You could change my mind if you brought any information to the table that shows how those two are worse than musk.
Enjoy your day.
Xi became president for life almost a decade ago, Putin ignored term limits in like 2008. Musk is failing to do what they have done, and he doesn’t even express any real power over the president given he hid his role from the courts and left the white house with a black eye.
Since you proudly champion the rights of Uyghur people, you are aware that the reeducation camps are closed since about 2022, right?
Competition is good for the consumer. More options from more players will encourage more charging infrastructure and (ostensibly) more innovation. It’s not just Elon Musk vs China. Every automaker that wants to sell cars in the USA is on notice. If they want to compete in the EV subcategory, they need to focus on price and performance. People want budget-conscious EVs.
Not super into cars but is there even any reason other than environmental friendliness to get an EV? Where I’m from, EVs are all wildly expensive compared to their combustion peers and they all frankly look really ugly to me. The coil whine of the EVs also drive me crazy.
Even the cheap ones accelerate faster, ride smoother, and are quieter. You don’t have to get oil changes, and the brakes don’t wear down as fast. Plus I can recharge at home, which is loads cheaper than buying gasoline.
And this is all with a relatively ancient Nissan Leaf, the new vehicles are all far better.
Oh, and let’s not forget that even very small air quality improvements have noticeable improvements in lung health! Humans were not meant to be breathing gasoline fumes or combustion exhaust.
My government just added a controversial extra tax on EVs because they tear up the roads and cause additional particles, because they are really heavy and most of them have a better than usual torque.
You can really see how road quality went to shit after EVs became mainstream.
Making batteries is also a really ugly business and far from environmental.
I can’t find anything on such a tax?
I feel like there has been an uptick in pro oil bots in the past week. Oil is a pretty ugly business too? What is wrong with you people.
Bio gas and diesel are also renewable.
If you are a moron, ya, it is.
With average EU energy mix total carbon footprint of a biogas car is still only 3/4 of an equivalent electric vehicle after 10 years of use.
Additional weight of the vehicle and the costly battery production matters.
With average US east coast energy mix the EVs carbon footprint would be double that of a biogas car after 10 years of use.
Others have addressed your other questions, but I want to add that the “coil whine” that irritates you is probably the car’s slow-moving warning system. EVs are effectively silent at slow speeds because there is no engine noise or road noise, so they are required to make an annoying sound when maneuvering to get your attention. While it is an important safety feature, I agree some are very obnoxious.
I’m not sure if we’re talking about the same sound as it’s so high pitched that most people older than me are unable to even hear it while people my age or younger can clearly identify it. If that’s supposed to be a warning system, it doesn’t seem very good?
I mean, it’s also entirely possible you’ve heard a failing magnetic drive, a humming battery, or a squeeky mechanical thing like brakes or bearings. Those are all strong indicators of a significant problem with the car, and should be fixed immediately. But if you hear it every time, as soon as the car starts moving in a parking lot, that’s the safety feature.
They make decent “point A to point B” cars, but that’s about it. They take a long time to charge, and when that battery is due for replacement, it might just total the car.
Everywhere is depndent on China, buy the car that isnt overtly a fascist car. They also suck.
that isn’t really an argument in favor of china 😂
They manufacture everything, they are just people chilling in their country. Say what you will about their form of government but BYD havent invested in hurting people for no reason.
China famously doesn’t have a far-right problem, unlike the EU or the USA, what are you talking about?
unless you for some reason like leftist dictator who would like to rule the world more than the right one, there isn’t really practical difference in this
China would love so much to rule the world, that’s why it hasn’t entered any war in the past 40+ years, and that’s why all countries in the global south are happy to enter the comparably advantageous economic deals and infrastructure investments that China offers in comparison with the magnificent western democracies.
How many countries has China bombed in the past 40 years? Let’s now make a list for the USA, see who wins!
As for “dictator”, look at the approval rates of Xi in China and compare them to those of Kid Starver in the UK, Trump in the US, or Macron in France. I guess democracy is best represented by the system that lets you choose which hateful ghoul will apply social austerity policy and invest 5% of GDP in NATO.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Hundred-Year_Marathon
are they happy? and are the deals advantageous? can you back up your claims? 😂
oh yes, the approval rating of a dictator in a dictatorship is very valid metric 😂. (hint hint: they are irrelevant even if they were not fixed. any kind of approval rating bears zero relevance to whether the country is a totalitarian state or not, or whether the country is a threat to its neighbours or not).
So, no wars, got it. Just overtaking the US through soft power and economic prowess, lmao.
finally. it took you some time, but better late than never. you are the only one talking about wars as if it means something.
I agree until the last part. Democracies have more freedoms allowing for more accurate polling. There is also less fear of consequences for being open. Countries should be able to defend themselves, 5% is a step toward peace. The cold war never became hot because of the investment in defence.
Tell that to the millions of people the west murdered through bombing of Korea, Vietnam or Laos, the millions more murdered though US support of military dictators such as Suharto or Pinochet, or the millions who died through the de-stabilization of their countries such as Mosaddeq’s Iran, Guatemala or the outright invasion of Iraq. Ask those people what they think of the west’s military expenses over the past century.
Literally two days ago Mamdani won the mayoral elections against all polls, polls in the west are heavily manipulated. And literally last week a man was denied entry in the country due to having a picture of bald Vance. I happen to be Spanish, and in our super-democratic state we have literal political prisoners who had to free the country such as Carles Puigdemont due to political persecution and risking their lives in jail. The west is NOT more democratic than China at this point, and the trend is towards openness in China and towards fascism in the west.
The trend is toward openness in China? Just off the top of my head didnt Xi consolidate more power over the last 12 months and stop issuing economic statistics as a resukt of their trend?
I am not American, they are a shit hole country, they have never been much more but the veneer is wiped off now.
Those proxy wars are the example of it not getting hot. Russia and the US had so much military power no one risked direct attacks.
I do not support the US, Israel or any such shite but dont tell half a story and sum up with china is opening up.
The article title is a bit sensational. The share of the market for all Chinese EV is 5,6%. It’s not ( yet ? ) a tsunami.
Telsas total european market share this month is 1.2%, down from 1.8% last may. The chinese market share is 5.9%, not 5.6%.
5.9% vs 1.2% is a 5x sales rate for chinese cars versus Teslas. According to the article, china doubled its EU market share in the last year, while Tesla lost 30% of its market share in the same time period.
The title is not sensational. If anything, your comment is a bit misleading by not listing the tesla EU market share.
Buy european? I mean if that’s an option.
There are lots of EVs by European car manufacturers. The problem is that they have trouble competing on price with the Chinese ones.
You’ ve been explained this whole scenario years ago when Putin was pushing for Europe from Lisbon to Vladivostok.
That was EU chance to get dirt cheap energy and raw materials.
And now - EU heavy industry is dying, car manufacturers are sold to China one by one. Decision made decade+ ago.